Ikea: Gypsy haters?

13 June 2012

ikeaAre you a traveller? Chances are, you won't be going to an Ikea store anytime soon after it was reported that 'your kind' aren't welcome. Astonishing, huh?

And this is exactly what Luke Massey found out when he paid a visit to the Valley Park outlet in South London. Arriving at the store with his girlfriend and mother in a camper van, one security guard challenged them, asking if they were Gypsies and, if they were, they wouldn't be allowed on-site.

Ikea is saying that they're not being prejudice, but rather, that they're protecting their business interests. Luke Massey said: "We were just aghast and my partner said 'What? Are you serious?' We argued with him there for about a minute before he said 'OK go on', it was like he was convinced we weren't gipsy so we could go on. I know this kind a camper van is slightly unusual, but it is not exclusively used by the travelling community."

The guard in question was caught on tape and said: "A lot of them are coming in similar cars. If you had said yes, I wouldn't have let you into the premises," adding: "We are stopping them because they are coming in and taking things of our loyal customers, that is why I'm here in the car park."

Massey added: "Even if they have had problems with travellers using their electricity supply or parking there at night it doesn't justify the racial profiling of customers at the front door. It is not acceptable, I'm disgusted."

Garry Deakin, the Ikea store manager at Croydon, defended the stance, saying: "Over recent months the travelling community in the Croydon area have been attempting to access the customer car park to set up their mobile homes. (It) not only has an impact on our customers' shopping experience, but also poses a health and safety risk due to the build up of human and animal waste."

"After discussions with both the local traveller liaison officer and Croydon Council, Ikea Croydon implemented preventative procedures to secure the car park, including a security officer to patrol the entry to the car park to prevent the mobile homes entering the car park."

What do you think?

TOPICS:   High Street News

101 comments

  • Mugwump
    Problem - ?
  • klingelton
    my opinion only - stop that thieving gypsy scum from setting foot on english soil ever again. They are not a race - they are scum.
    • Larryward

      Hi I am a Irish traveler and I am no scum what makes you any better than me we have some very strong morals and carry this country's culture more than you whould no no one has to steal any thing we can well afford what we want you might get the odd camp here and there you have just racely discriminated me witch is a criminal offence watch it son and make more in a week than you make on your yearly salary  

  • Wongaporkpies
    You'll always find Gypsies in Kitchens at parties. Usually nicking all the food and electrical appliances :p
  • Kevin N.
    Maybe Luke Massey would like a pikey camp to be setup in his garden where they can steal the lead from his roof and shit in his pond.
  • Seymour
    quite right as well. However, I wish Bitterwallet would use the politically correct term of "travellers" as some people may find the term "gypsies" insulting.
  • Kevin
    Totally valid idea although in that case it sounds rather ridiculous. It's because if someone decides to park on your land you're not allowed to tow them out or set it on fire. Pretty simple reasoning behind it.
  • Sicknote
    Only because an Ikea car park is to a pikey bastard what a fresh dog turd is to a fly - they can't fucking resist setting up camp and flinging their shit everywhere. I'm not being prejudice either; I know from first hand in your face experience that Pikeys are thieving scum bags that shit on everyone.
  • chris
    Not a race just scum? Hitler thought the same and your great grandfathers went to war against him, bet they will be proud of you. your the scum and a disgrace to your family
  • Dirty D.
    Do gypsies bum foxes? We have great problems with them here. illeagal sites, human waste issues, local thieving. Council and police are too PC to do anything, we just keep picking up the tab.
  • g
    fucking scum, i wouldn't want them in ikea if i were trying to shop there. i say burn them all
  • vibeone
    Seymour - call a spade a spade. Gypsy scum is fine, and I applaud Bitterwallet.
  • dvdj10
    Fair enough although their will be outcry over it. Luke Massey should try harder not to look like a gypsy.
  • Stan L.
    Luke Massey probably isn't a Gypsy. More likely an Irish Tink, as they were called when I was a lad.
  • FJ
    Luke Massey seems more upset about being mistaken for one than anything else.
  • james d.
    I hate discrimination, but I really just can't help disliking gypsies. All the gypsies I have ever seen destroy their surroundings, steal and cause disruption. ALL of them, if there are any nice friendly gypsies who respect the community they have moved into, obey the law and pay their taxes then I'll take it back. But I don't believe there are.
  • Derooftrouser
    Does Godwin's Law apply when commenters are advocating *exactly* what the Nazis did? Fucking racist scum.
  • james d.
    its not racist, its prejudice. I dont think anyone is suggesting if you adopted a gypsy baby and brought it up in a loving family with a sense of community and respect for their surroundings their gypsy DNA would kick in and they would start stealing and causing widespread disruption. However it seems to me that if you constantly move around without putting down roots you develop no respect for your environment and care only for your own traveller community. This is why I dislike them, it is a side effect of their lifestyle not a Nazi like belief they should be exterminated. If I said "all fishermen are basturds" it wouldn't be racist, its the same thing. It's their lifestyle I don't like not their DNA or heritage.
  • james d.
    Oh also, if you disagree why don't you visit your local gypsy camp and try to make some friends, see how that works out for you.
  • Derooftrouser
    Oh, sorry dude, it's just when you said "Every member of ethnic group [x] acts in negative fashion [y]" it sounded like the dictionary definition of fucking racism. Seriously, go fuck yourself, you racist cretin.
  • Me_again
    There's a longstanding history of problems with travellers setting up home within the Croydon site. Makeshift overhead bars are installed at several retailers in the area in an attempt to stop overheight caravans from entering. Prevention seems a little more attractive than protracted eviction procedures?
  • james d.
    not sure if that is directed at me. I said all the ones I have ever seen. Maybe all the nice gypsies are sat in their caravans behaving themselves and only the wanker gypsies come out stealing and intimidating people.
  • Clarke
    If it wasn't so disgusting it would almost be funny. The typical mind-set of the racist-in-denial. Laudable how you bravely back each other up in the back-pages of the internet. "Burn them all"!? There IS a group of people the world would be better without and that's people who think like you, not Travellers. You pathetic, nasty idiots.
  • Shooter M.
    Seymour, I find political correctness insulting. What should we do about that little quandry?
  • Betty S.
    WTF is dis real?
  • Paddy
    Call them what ever you want-pikeys, gypies, knackers, travellers-they're scum. I'm speaking from personal experience-they will turn a neighbourhood into a hell-hole. The one time that ethnic cleansing can be justified.
  • Clarke
    Paddy, are you OK!? I mean, what those "Gypies" as you call them must have done to you must have been horrible BEYOND COMPREHENSION if the only solution is to now wipe out every last man, woman and child. It must have been truly horrific! I feel for you man... ..on the other hand you could just be another pea-brained racist.
  • Gorgeous G.
    I fucking hate pikeys
  • Oliverreed
    "If you had said yes, I wouldn’t have let you into the premises" phew, Jack Bauer can stand down now with those interrogation techniques.... Whatever you think of them it isn't beyond their wit to lie is it?
  • Oliverreed
    For the comments above from people who have actually experienced van dwellers, (and maybe the comments that follow - if this thread continues) there is a real raw sense of anger.
  • Paddy
    @clarke, I couldn't give a toss what you think. I've experience the scumbags at their very worse and I make no apologies whatsoever. They have got no redeeming features whatsoever unless you care to point out any? I'm a pea-brained racist? Who is making assumptions now? I'm speaking from experience of them and I cannot think of one positive thing to say about their 'race'.
  • Clarke
    OK Paddy, I stand corrected. You're an "unrepentant pea-brained racist". Good response. Sorry, just can't take you seriously.
  • Paddy
    @clarke, You're just a cunt. And I'm definitely not taking you seriously.
  • Clarke
    Bravo Paddy, good evening
  • leslie b.
    I work at a well known supermarket-green sign ring a bell. Sitting with my colleagues that I have worked alongside with, bemoaned incapable management with. Never left a colleague stuck, always felt we were a team and when always stayed back to lend a helping hand when needed. Then one day sitting in a briefing I and my 20 or so colleagues were informed to watch out for 'gypos'. That we will know them when we see them and that security has to be a priority when 'those' people come in the store. I was stunned, not by the breifing itself, but because every person who knew I was a traveller in that room remained quite throughout this breifing. Not one person who I had falsely considered a freind stood up for me. It was hurtful-yet insightful. They all shared the same opinion an I was never seen as an individual and taken on my own merits. It makes me grateful for the people that matter in my life and that my grandfather and his brothers fought to ensure as a country we have freedom of speech and choice and thinking of the sacrifice they an others have made makes me feel better that for the people who let you down there is always someone better to take their place.
  • leslie b.
    Hello?
  • Vibeone
    Vibeone, A spade me be a spade, but is a Spork a fork or a spoon?
  • Vibeone
    Hey guys, in the rush to submit my ingenious, sophisticated and well thought out reply, I appear to have made a grammatical error. I apologize profusely for this and have amended the passage below:- Vibeone, A spade may be a spade, but is a Spork a fork or a spoon?
  • Seymour
    Sorry guys, I appear to have mistaken the "name" field as to who I was sending my message to. The following two posts were by me:- "Vibeone, A spade me be a spade, but is a Spork a fork or a spoon?" "Hey guys, in the rush to submit my ingenious, sophisticated and well thought out reply, I appear to have made a grammatical error. I apologize profusely for this and have amended the passage below:- Vibeone, A spade may be a spade, but is a Spork a fork or a spoon?"
  • Seymour
    I am deeply sorry, I really have made a mess of this comment section..
  • Wonkey H.
    I bum foxes
  • peacheyd
    To be honest, i am pretty raciest and prejudice . Bollox to pikey rights, they don't contribute anything , they don't even pay taxes so they have fuck all right to be anywhere near me when I'm shopping for packs of 10000000 tea lights and 12p hotdogs!
  • leslie b.
    Does anyone need their drive tarmaced by the way?
  • Dick
    @leslie bell How does a "traveller" hold down a job? Or by traveller do you mean you live permanently in an illegal caravan park?
  • Chewbacca
    Of course "leslie bell" can afford the to live on piss-poor wages that ASDA pay, she doesn't pay any council tax etc! Travellers are tax-dodging scum and deserve to be euthanased at birth. Racist? Nah, I just hate anyone who doesn't contribute and abide by the laws and customs of this country. Same goes for dole scroungers, single mothers and immigrants. Don't contribute? Don't deserve to exist.
  • Spencer
    In defense of the travelling community...... um....... ???
  • Indy Y.
    Chewbacca said this: "Travellers are tax-dodging scum and deserve to be euthanased at birth. Racist? Nah, I just hate anyone who doesn’t contribute and abide by the laws and customs of this country." It's very hard to argue that you're not racist when you've basically just vehemently argued that a particular group of people should be wiped from the face of the Earth. So no - you are in fact a racist, you massive massive racist. Of course, there's the possibility that you're doing deadpan satire of the rest of these clowns and aren't some sort of swivel-eyed EDL jackass.
  • Chewbacca
    @Indy Riiiiiiigggghhhhhhhtttttt. Anyone who dares question the morals/ethics/customs of an lecherous/invasive "race" must automatically be racist, yeah? Or perhaps people like me just resent working my arse off to pay taxes whilst these workshy feckless morons suck the lifeblood out of this country whilst contributing precisely fuck all? Namby pamby lefties like you are actually worse as you allow these people to continue, unfettered, and allow them to poison this country. You, sir, deserve the very same as them. In days of old, you would have been declared a traitor. And rightly so.
  • Derooftrouser
    Hey, Chewie, you're a racist cuntbubble. Calling another ethnic group "lecherous/invasive" - racist. Saying all members of that group act in a particular anti-social way - racist. Advocating Nazi genocide policy - unsurprisingly, racist. In this exchange there's only one traitor to British ideals, and it's you, you prejudiced dickbag.
  • Derooftrouser
    Right, HUKD deals account wiped, and both it and BW are going in the amended hosts file so they can't be accessed. The lack of moderation on the comments here is fucking shameful. You get the commenters you deserve, BW, and you're welcome to your shower of racist dicksplashes.
  • Chewbacca
    @Derooftrouser You're overreacting slightly. I'm not spitting the dummy about you calling me racist, when you clearly don't know the meaning of the word. Ok, I'll play along. Which "race" have I made this slight against? Travellers? Not a race. Immigrants? Not a race. Single mothers? Again, not a race. This is the problem with people like you. You shout "racist" in your highest, squeakiest voice to all and sundry without actually having much of a clue about what that means. Then, in some pathetic attempt to strengthen the case you believe you have, you go on about the Nazis, destroying any shred of credibility you may have had. Perhaps you like people to sponge off the state, and therefore from you. Or perhaps you're a dole scrounger yourself, hence all your indignation. I don't really care. When travellers pitch up in you back garden and you're the only English speaker left in your town, please let me know. Because I just LOVE to say "I told you so".
  • International D.
    PART I Article 1 1. In this Convention, the term "racial discrimination" shall mean any distinction, exclusion, restriction or preference based on race, colour, descent, or national or ethnic origin which has the purpose or effect of nullifying or impairing the recognition, enjoyment or exercise, on an equal footing, of human rights and fundamental freedoms in the political, economic, social, cultural or any other field of public life.
  • Rob
    I don't like IKEA. Do I absolutely have to be a traveller to poo in their car park?
  • Chewbacca
    @ International Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Racial Discrimination Bore off. Realism: noun 1. interest in or concern for the actual or real, as distinguished from the abstract, speculative, etc. 2. the tendency to view or represent things as they really are. 3. Fine Arts . a. treatment of forms, colors, space, etc., in such a manner as to emphasize their correspondence to actuality or to ordinary visual experience. Compare idealism ( def. 4 ) , naturalism ( def. 2 ) . b. ( usually initial capital letter ) a style of painting and sculpture developed about the mid-19th century in which figures and scenes are depicted as they are experienced or might be experienced in everyday life. 4. Literature . a. a manner of treating subject matter that presents a careful description of everyday life, usually of the lower and middle classes. b. a theory of writing in which the ordinary, familiar, or mundane aspects of life are represented in a straightforward or matter-of-fact manner that is presumed to reflect life as it actually is. Compare naturalism ( def. 1b ) . 5. Philosophy . a. the doctrine that universals have a real objective existence. Compare conceptualism, nominalism. b. the doctrine that objects of sense perception have an existence independent of the act of perception. Compare idealism ( def. 5a ) .
  • Han
    Accept it Chewie. You're a racist. You might think your racism is justified but that's OK; most racists think that their hatred is justified. Go and get that can of petrol and sort a few of the scum out eh? Or are you a big mouth that hopes that somebody else will do all of the killing you think is appropriate? You're advocating mass murder - racism is the least of your issues.
  • Chewbacca
    @ Han Give it up. Mass murder? Really? Really? And why create multis to post anyway? What are you trying to hide? Pathetic.
  • Spencer
    Chewie is most likely trolling..... Most people on here do.... But... in case he's not... I actually support his argument. For the simple reason 'racism' is a 'one size fits all' word thrown at anybody deemed to be speaking in an un-pc manner towards people of different nations or cultures or ethnic origin. Racism is in fact, utterly impossible. Seriously, take the time to look it up. Race is defined as common genetic ancestry... where we share the same genetic traits... the thing about that is... every human on the planet shares the same common genetic ancestry - we all go back to the same genetic point... ergo 'the human race'. So we can only be 'racist' towards animals of different species to our own - in which instance we are being specist - and not racist.
  • Han
    Feel free to retract you previous comments if you feel you can't stand by them. None of the comments from the first page are mine. I'd guess there is more than one person that thinks you have overstepped the line here. So do you advocate the extermination of these people at birth or not? Read what you said.
  • Chewbacca
    @ Spencer Kinda what I was getting at. You'd be more accurate to accuse me of intolerance towards certain cultures. No matter. The morons jump straight to shouting "racist" while looking very foolish indeed.
  • Spencer
    Secondly - and by far the most important - If you are going to call anybody racist - be sure you understand exactly what it means, what it implies, and that you're not confusing racism with xenophobia, religious intolerance, or ethnicity.... Lastly, we have freedom of speech in this country and if you find somebody annoying or frustrating, you're free to declare so. Saying I hate gypsies is expressing a personal opinion as to a particular culture - there's nothing wrong with that whatsoever - you're not being defamatory in any way - you're simply expressing your opinion.
  • Spencer
    Finally - The gypsies are NOT a race of people. They are an ethnic group. And for the benefit of those who don't know, ethnicity is a cultural grouping with shared behaviour and social structure - it has NOTHING to do with race. So to speak out against the problems gypsies sometimes cause is expressing your opinion towards a particular ethnic group. It is not, and cannot be classed as racist.
  • Spencer
    As for the nazi's - religious intolerance - yes (the jews) Xenophobia - yes (Disliked a lot of countries) Ethnic intolerance - (again, most of Europe) racism? difficult - they wanted to modify human genetics and create die herrenrasse.... but they never did so.... hmmm...?
  • Han
    I'll base my definition of the work racist on the grounding of 'racial discrimnation' as defined in the UN convention and approved by the UK if it's all the same to you Spencer. It's not just something I made up, thanks. Feel free to speak out about problems as there surely are many. However, to advocate extermination by killing children is not acceptable to me. This statement by Chewbacca is racist and he has has the opportunity to withdraw it but chooses not to. I never brought up Nazi's and never would. Please remember that freedom of speech is limited in this country; advocating murder is a crime.
  • Han
    Off to watch some tellie now. Goodnight
  • Spencer
    Presumably then Han... you view the Gypsies as a race?
  • Spencer
    You would have to in order that Chewie is being racist?
  • Spencer
    Race noun 1. a group of persons related by common descent or heredity. ethnicity noun 1. The fact or state of belonging to a social group that has a common national or cultural tradition. By calling chewie racist, you are inferring a social group of people (an ethnicity) as a race.... Which aside from being incorrect, is also... (comically) racist and discriminatory as per your definition. This is kind of off point though... the fact is, when it comes to different ethnicities (Gypsies or otherwise) etc... Chewie, and anybody as well as you Han - is completely free to express their opinion on the matter.
  • leslie b.
    At least I do not feel ashamed of my comments. I do not have to hid behind a handle to post what I have to say. I do not have to answer to someone who is not man or woman enough to use a non fictional name to spout their beliefs. I hold down a jon wherever I may be and that is the way my grandparents and parents taught me to love. I pay council tax when I do not have to dispose of my own rubbish and buy my own water. However even when I pay tax I have to ask really?! How much do they need to empty my frikkin bin! Lol and how many bins do I need! It was hard to get an education and my parents felt for me but they wanted me to make the choice to keep trying or stay at home where I would be protected. I tried-it was hard. I was spat on, morally crushed and even stoned once. But my parents taught me something a lot of children I come into contact seem to lack nowadays-respect for oneself and the drive to keep going. I may work at a supermarket but this is only partime. I hold down three jobs. I make my parents proud. I make my husband proud. On a by note 5 of my cousins also work at the same supermarket. Strange how you seem to know a traveller by sight yet they could be the person serving you next time you visit-no tag on the forehead or tag on our chest. 'If you prick us do we not bleed'
  • leslie b.
    Job! Omg how shaming lol
  • james d.
    yeah even though I fall into the anti-gypsy camp calling for their slaughter is pretty indefensible.
  • Chewbacca
    Oh Christ, Say something tongue in cheek and you get all the lefties up in arms. Of course I wouldn't want children killed at birth, adoption away from their parents would be more than sufficient. A mass sterilisation programme for the parents would work too. And leslie bell - a supermarket full of pikeys? Their stock loss must be astronomical!
  • Indy Y.
    @chewbacca and also spencer It really doesn't matter how you try to define your horrible views in terms of "expressing your opinion" or "not racist". The fact of the matter is that, at the end of the day, they are still horrible views. The opinions you hold are loathsome, bullying, vicious, and speak to something dark and troubling that may be a part of your larger natures. I cannot honestly say what you are like beyond my experience of the beliefs you espouse here, but really there needs to be some comment moderation because the stuff you are coming out with is actual hate speech any way you slice it.
  • Spencer
    I'm sorry Indy - at what point have I expressed any hatred or animosity to travellers or Gypsies? I said I support Chewies argument... by which I mean, the traveller community can often be troublesome and a burden to the communities in which they reside. I'm not getting pulled into drawing sweeping generalizations - there are almost always exceptions to the rule... I simply agree with some of the opinions chewie expressed. Oh and BTW - I live in Tilbury and am surrounded by 4 separate sites of them - and can speak from first hand experience... The fact that the value of my house has decreased by 15% is pretty much directly related to some of the problems these people cause.
  • Spencer
    Can I ask Indy/Han a question - I find certain aspects of certain cultures, ethnicities etc... utterly barbaric and repugnant. Lets take, for example, certain countries and cultures that publicly stone people to death or that have brutal military regimes that torture and murder dissidents... Am I allowed to be offended by those aspects without being labelled 'racist'?
  • Indy Y.
    Just a quick response - you express animosity or hatred for a group when you repeatedly express support and agreement for the person who is speaking about the group using eliminationist rhetoric. If you agree with that person, people will assume that you think the same or similar things to what that person thinks, hence the agreement. If you back up chewbacca's arguments, people might come to the conclusion that you agree with him.
  • Shooter M.
    There's an awful lot of anti-wookiee racism in this thread
  • Han
    "I’ll base my definition of the word racist on the grounding of ‘racial discrimination’ as defined in the UN convention and approved by the UK if it’s all the same to you Spencer. It’s not just something I made up, thanks." I've corrected the word 'word' in case it was confusing. A racist is a person that advocates 'racial discrimination' as defined in the document cited above. It's used in that context. Apparently you don't think that anybody has put any thought into racism before and that using that word racist is an easy option. It isn't. I've based my statement on international standards, European conventions and UK law which accepts racism as a factor in crimes. Chewbacca is a racist or pretends to be one very well. I make the assumption that he means what he says; this is a valid position. He also incites murder, forced adoption and forced sterilisation. Of course, it may well be just a joke to him but the statements can be taken to represent his true thoughts by a reasonable person. Fine. I don't think that you agree with him but I do think that you make assumptions about the use of the word 'racist'. In your arguments you try to use linguistics to argue that racism is not possible. The semantics arguments has been made many times and so I refer you again to the conventions and UK law where that argument has been settled. He's also ruined the first three Star Wars films. Now I know why he's the only character they didn't put subtitles in for; he's probably joking about burning all the sandpeople kids.
  • Chewbacca
    Look guys - it all boils down to a lack of respect. Lack of respect for our customs. Lack of respect for our laws. Lack of respect for our language. Lack of respect for our history. Yet some of you think we still should respect them. Majority rules, or at least, it should.
  • Han
    That's a poor attempt to broarden your trolling Chewie. How do your prior statements fit in with your last one? Respect for out laws? You advocate murder and forced sterilization. These are illegal so you show no respect for our laws. Respect for language. Travelers can speak English. Yourcomment is senseless. Respect for history. Historical records show migrants, travellers ang Romany Gipsies in this country for several centuries. Exactly which customs are you talking about? You should let your self-appointed lawyer Spencer speak for you because you can't even make a consistent racist argument.
  • Ha h.
    Quick Spencer! Chewie needs you to help him explain "Kinda what I was getting at."
  • Spencer
    I do not espouse murder, genocide, infanticide or any such nonsense... and I suspect chewie doesn't either.. I guess my view point is a little like an inverse Evelyn hall... the difference being I do, in parts, agree with some of the stated principles... I do however feel that anyone should be free to express their opinion... and engage in reasoned debate... rather than just be lambasted and ignored for having an un-pc opinion. And yes star wars had no place for a giant gargling hair ball that did absolutely nothing....
  • Chewbacca
    Oh, and Han: "Respect for language. Travelers can speak English. Yourcomment is senseless." Can they? You've never seen Snatch, have you? And yes, Snatch was a documentary.
  • Han
    Have I made unreasonable statements Spencer? I think that my statements have been based on sound footings from the start. I even cited my source before deciding he was a racist. You may not agree with me but it discourteous to assume I have no footing to rest my views upon. Perhaps you were lambasting me before thinking about wether I has any reasonable basis for my view. Did I attack you for your views because you were 'on his side'? No; I simply referred you again to the basis for my view. Do you concider Chewbacca's initial statements "reasonable"? Are they based on anything but aggressive prejudice? Did he retract or clarify his comments before you stepped in to help him out? If Chewbacca is trolling (attention seeking by exaggerating his oppinions) then you may like to concider his posts about how much he hates trolling. I took him at his word and assumed he was not trolling; just giving his real views. Are we supposed to believe what he says or not? It is my conclusion that Chewbacca is not making a reasonable argument or taking part in a reasoned debate. You are, but the what is racism argument has been done a tens of thousands of times and I would refer you to those debates. Chewbacca can hang onto your tailcoats there if he chooses. I have chosen a definition, it is clear and accomodated by UK law. His statements suggest violent racially motivated action and he stands by them. He is a racist.
  • Han
    Wow Chewie, you give one example of a documentary where some travelers can't speak English! That means all of them can't. You couldn't even face the other three points you brought up. Spencer, can you tackle the other three points for him?
  • Chewbacca
    Han, My other comment is awaiting moderation. Snatch ISN'T a documentary. Jeez. You've lost the plot man. Anyway, good to see you're intent on calling me a racist. I'd better tell my friends about this, particularly the asian and Irish ones. They'll laugh when they realise I've been fooling the, all along! What jolly japes indeed, eh?! Spencer hit the nail on the head - it's not racist to dislike traits of any given group of people. You can hardly deny that travellers do, in general, bring crime and disruption into areas they inhabit. Whilst sweeping generalisations aren't always helpful, you can hardly say you'd like a bunch of travellers setting up near you?
  • Spencer
    Could I... yes but England are 1-0 up.. maybe later :)
  • Han
    Really Chewie? The "I'm not racist because I've got black friends?" defense? Starting to backpedal now eh? "dislike traits" "in general" What's wrong with killing them all, the people not the "traits" you're trying to switch to. Or we're you just trolling?
  • Spencer
    Firstly, in my opinion, it is unreasonable to infer a labelling on an ethnic group - as a race... but this is a matter of opinion... You take your definitions from the U.N - I'll take mine from a dictionary. I could argue the point that a dictionary is kind of a difinitive reference of meanings... but there's little point... It's a matter of opinion and I'm quite happy to agree to disagree... That being said, as per your definition - you're inferring the title of 'race' onto travellers. Which is, defamatory and somewhat arrogant... Surely it should be up to a race of people to infer that definition upon themselves... not for someone to slap that label on them as they see fit (as I said previously - doing that actually amounts to racism as per the U.N definition) - So in short - yes, even if we go by your definition - your remarks are unreasonable. Secondly, I have at no point lambasted or criticized you or your opinions - nor have I labelled you or anyone else as anything offensive. - Except The star wars character Chewbacca... Thirdly, No I do not consider many of Chewbaccas statements as reasonable. If he does hold those extreme beliefs - that is up to him, he has the right to feel that way. I have already made it very clear I do not share those extremist views - instead - I agree with chewbacca in as much that, having 1st hand experience with the travelling community, they can often be quite troublesome. They are often antisocial and do create directly attributible problems. In that sense I am not pro-traveller - and neither is chewie... However, felt compelled to step behind him on this because it angers me how readily the word 'racist' is thrown about and slapped on people. again - I can only re-post the question I posted earlier which highlights this point: I find certain aspects of certain cultures, ethnicities etc… utterly barbaric and repugnant. Lets take, for example, certain countries and cultures that publicly stone people to death or that have brutal military regimes that torture and murder dissidents… Am I allowed to be offended by those aspects without being labelled ‘racist’? Anyway, match is on....
  • Chewbacca
    "I find certain aspects of certain cultures, ethnicities etc… utterly barbaric and repugnant." As do I. But this is the thing, the pc brigade want you to embrace ALL aspects of ALL of these people. It's like banging your head off a brick wall. They don't understand why people don't want their recreation grounds littered with filth, or why they don't want to have to new alarm systems etc etc...
  • regular n.
    Losers
  • Han
    Hello again spencer. I took my definition from that source for a reason. A dictionary is not very useful as a legal document. Being a racist isn't illegal and so it it difficult to prove that somebody is a racist in the eyes of the law. I have repeatedly called Chewbacca a racist. Despite what you seem to say about freedom of speech there are many limitations on what I can write with impunity. By putting my accusation in writing I am offering Chewbacca an option to prove that what he is said cannot truthfully be called racist. I offer you, Chewbacca, the opportunity to demonstrate that I am wrong by suing me for libel. I will only offer the defense of "truth". Please feel free to obtain my details through this website and then my ISP unless you would like to exchange details through an intermediary such as Andrew Dawson. Chewbacca, I have asked nothing of you but for you to state your true feelings and oppinions. I have not asked you to stop, I have not threatened you or even asked you to change your mind. It isn't illegal to be a racist and I am not of the opinion that racists should be silenced; quite the contrary. Feel free to keep posting away although you might want to concider the content more carefully as I will be using your messages as my defence.
  • The P.
    Loosers.
  • speaking e.
    For those of you wearing your 'Hug a Pikey' t-shirts please stop branding posters here and spend your energy petitioning for them to have a site based next to your house. Think of the wonderful benefits they'll bring like the instant surge in property prices in your area and insurance costs would halve whilst you sleep peacefully every night without a care or concern. Any volunteers?
  • captain c.
    Han shot himself in the foot earlier, he talked about "Romany Gypsies"; sorry!! 99% of the "Gypsies" in this country are Irish Tinkers, or "New Age Travellers", the term has become generic, like "hoover". REAL Romany Gypsies tend to be honest and hard working (if not always completely law abiding). Tinkers on the other hand, have been roaming the UK stealing anything not nailed down and defecating on any unspoiled green area for several centuries; in modern times they have been joined by the NAT who have often not even bothered too much with the robbery as it is too much like hard work, when they can sponge off of the state and dabble in petty theft and vandalism when they feel bored. Am I a racist?? NO, I believe that if a person or group insists on living outside of the rules and laws of a country, they should not be entitled to all the protections and benefits of that country. WE pay tax that is spent (among other things), to provide hospitals, schools and social care; the "Gypsies" dont, so why should they be allowed to use these services?? (This goes for the life-long professional benefit claimers as well). Gypsy is a nice, romantic word; lets ditch it and use a more correct, descriptive word such as "PARASITE", or "LOCUST".
  • Jordan
    I can only speak from personal experience and my only contact with Gypsies has been their annual invasion of our work carpark - They stay for 2 weeks until the council moves them on. The last time the 'visited' they let all of their kids scratch every window on the bottom floor of the building and deposited their chemical toilets all over the road along with all their other rubbish. Strangely there was also a stolen, burn out car left this time. If they weren't so horrible to people perhaps they wouldn't be universally disliked. I am just speaking from personal experience.
  • Paddy
    @captain, Spot on. I fucking hate pikeys/knackers and as most of them are Irish (and I am as well-hence the nickname....), does that make me a self-hating racist?
  • Chelmsfordman
    I have no issue with travellers - as long as they generally are going to travel. Building brick walled gardens around static homes in plots of land they break into and then declare they have a right to.......someone explain to me how this is acceptable? And someone explain to me why the crime rate goes through the roof (and housing prices plummet / houses become unsellable)when the 'travelling' community arrive in huge numbers. There kids distrupt the schools as they have little to no interest in them. Horse and cart on A roads cause traffic issues daily, and you ask any pub or restaurant landlord - its the death of there pub when the travellers decide they want to use it. Theft through the roof, and no one but the travellers will now go near it). I also love how its ok for 13 year old to drive on the roads (seen it myself many times getting petrol and a dodgy van pulls up and out gets a young boyfrom the drivers side) I havent even mentioned about paying taxes, or being responsible with their waste......... But I guess that makes me a 'racist' bit like crossing the road when faced with a gang of hoodies must also make me racist yeah? I prefer to think im Smart and learning from experience.
  • me
    I am going to post a random text here as I am sure nobody reads these long posts until the end! Cut testicles into thin slices. Fry briefly, adding finely chopped onion, garlic, black ground pepper and chilli. Cook while gradually adding water. When nearly finished, add white wine. When wine evaporates a bit, add mix seasoning, pepper, thyme, milfoil, red pepper powder, mint herb and a tablespoon of flour. Mix all well until wine completely evaporates and at the very end add honey and chocolate. Instead of red ground seasoning pepper you can use tomato puree. Tomato puree is used to get red colour, so don't use ketchup.
  • Neil J.
    I think Ikea have the right to protect their business and that includes their car parking spaces from anyone they perceive to be detrimental to their business image. I would certainly think twice about using a supermarket that was half full of traveller's caravans. But that just comes down to my own perception and experience. And mine from living near a traveller's site in Cardiff weren't positive. The number of police visits to the site and the surrounding areas increased substantially. The number of thefts and vandalism to property and vehicles also increased substantially. The travelling community are a minority and do not always adhere to what the majority of the society deem as normal rules. You can read all you like in the Daily Mail, but until you have first hand experience you should reserve judgement. Try living in an area near a traveller's site and make up your own mind. Unfortunately in my experience the travelling community expect to be treated fairly by society and the state, but on many occasions fail to treat those in the same way.
  • Peter C.
    Your testicle recipe sounds delicious, is this for Gypsy testicles?
  • leslie b.
    Yeah 'posted by me'! Stand by your prejudiced views. You have no idea how juvenile it sounds to say one small group speaks for everyone. Erm let's see does bin laden speak or act on behalf of all his countrymen? Think possibly no?! Grow up!

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