DVLA act unlawfully whilst losing your letters and blaming you for it

May 5th, 2010 100 Comments By Mof Gimmers

dvla 300x158 DVLA act unlawfully whilst losing your letters and blaming you for itMany companies act like complete arseholes when correspondence goes missing. The amount of times I haven’t been sent a letter or the postman has eaten it (or whatever they do with them), to be then chased up with a grouchy phonecall has gone past the point of trying to remember a number.

However, most companies will concede and sort things out with you whilst you’re on the phone. Not quite the case with the DVLA who’s off-road notification system has been described as “a shambles” and “legally unenforceable” and in “administrative chaos” according to The Reg.

Two court cases suggest that the DVLA has been acting unlawfully and, despite what it thinks, doesn’t have the power to push motorists around like they do.

In one case, the DVLA was seeking a judgement against James Collins on the grounds that he had failed to notify it when took his vehicle off the road (SORN). However, Mr Collins had indeed notified them and in fact, it was the DVLA who had dropped a bollock by losing his details. The judge agreed that it wasn’t Mr Collins’ fault and he shouldn’t have to stump up the cash to send correspondence by recorded delivery or any proof of posting for that matter.

If that was the case, and us plebs had to send everything by secure means, then the same would need to be required of any organisation we dealt with and, of course, they wouldn’t want that as their postage costs would go through the roof.

In another similar case, Duncan Peck had a row with the DVLA over lost paperwork. The DVLA tried it on and said that Mr Peck should’ve rung them if he didn’t receive any acknowledgement from them. Once again, the judge in question sided with the public saying that the DVLA have no statutory power requiring anyone to ring them.

This of course, doesn’t stop the DVLA sending out bailiffs should anyone try to cross swords with it. These rulings could well be a serious blow to the organisation.

The simple fact of the matter is that the DVLA do lose mail and correspondence and are still seemingly happy to send out debt collection agencies even while complaints are under investigation.

This simply isn’t good enough from a company that pockets somewhere in the region of £10m per year from penalty notices.

A spokesman for the DVLA: “The DVLA does not impose any requirements for customers to obtain proof of posting or use recorded delivery in their dealings with us. However, and this is a key point, the onus is on the customer to ensure their off-road notification is delivered to DVLA.”

“With reference to non-receipt of acknowledgement letters by customers, there is no legal obligation on the customer to contact DVLA if they do not receive their acknowledgement letter. However, and another key point, we do advise customers to contact us if this happens so that we can confirm if their notification has been delivered to us or advise them otherwise how to comply”.

There are calls to have a more open and transparent appeal system concerning the DVLA as, currently, they are self-regulatory. With these court cases and apparently lack of sympathy for genuine mistakes, the DVLA could lose the support of all motorists.

Comments (100) Jump to most recent comment
  1. Posted by Gary July 4, 2014 at 5:09 pm

    When you sell your car the DVLA will now fine you if you do not inform them about it. This means that if the Royal Mail or the DVLA loose your returned slip from the log book you can expect a nice big fat fine! Hows that for a kick in the teeth? You can phone them and protest but this will achive nothing and if you dont pay up they will take you to court where you will face a £1000 fine plus costs if you loose.

    This means that it is in the interest of the DVLA to loose as many of these returned slips as they can. They will bully you and you will feel you have no option but to pay up.

    Here is what i did on 10/09/2012 …………. I allowed the DVLA to take me to court. At the court i pleaded not guilty. As the law stands in the UK a letter is deemed SENT when it is posted and not when it arrives. This means that the DVLA must prove that you did not post it and that is impossible for them to do! The result being that i won.


  2. Posted by Gary July 4, 2014 at 5:17 pm

    Hi, i am the writer of the origional post following my court victory against the DVLA. I am back again to help you get the facts of this case straight.

    The origional post was written on arrival home straight after the court hearing and was written whilest i was still on a high following the victory.

    Here are the facts incase you should find your self in this situation and need help.

    I sold my car back in Jan 2012 and posted off the slip from the logbook to inform the DVLA of the change of ownership.

    Foolishly i did this by first class mail and the DVLA did not recieve it.

    In future i will be sending them by recorded delivery or will hand them in at a local DVLA office and get a reciept but i suppose you live and learn.

    As is standard practice the DVLA issued me with an £80 for not informing them.

    I called them by phone to protest but was told that the fine had to be paid.

    At this point many people would just pay up – even if they know they posted it off 1st class because they have no proof of posting. I however did nothing and a couple of months later a court summons came.

    On the court summons it says that if found guilty you will be fined up to £1000 plus £90 costs. Another great insentive to pay the £80 fine. Even if you are inocent.

    This court letter is nothing more than an empty threat. The DVLA can NOT win this case in a court of law no matter how much they threaten you as long as you remember to plead NOT GUILTY!

    In the UK a posted letter is deemed SERVED when you pop it in the post box. YOU DO NOT NEED PROOF OF POSTING.

    In court the DVLA would have to prove that you did not post it and not even Paul Daniels could pull off that trick!

    Hence the DVLA will have a case that they have no possible way of winning and will back down.

    In my case they left the backing down until 15mins before the hearing, but i think that they have now learned a good lesson and will back down much sooner in future.

    Just remember – stick to not guilty (no matter what) and you cant loose. You dont need to prove you posted it – they need to prove you didn’t and that is impossible!

    I hope you never need to use this advice but use it and it will save you alot of money.

  3. Posted by Vicky July 15, 2014 at 10:26 pm

    Thanks for info Gary I’m getting threats and a court summonses just arrived. I did inform them and they are saying they didn’t receive it too. Very worried about the whole situation and getting a criminal record

  4. Three times my daughter has not received any notification of summonses but has had the bailiffs turning up for payment THREE times. The origninal fines where for £60, the actual amount she has had to pay has been £450. She wasnt even aware of any court proceedings because she hadnt received any letters. The latest is for £600. What can she do???

  5. Posted by Matt Devlin July 31, 2014 at 10:25 pm

    Hi Gary,

    I have the same situation and I would really like to speak to you regarding this?!
    Is there any way that we can speak? Weird request I know…

    Hoping to speak to you soon.

    Matt Devlin.

  6. I am in exactly same situation now being fined for a car I sold six months previously. Can’t even speak to dvla as automated system produces a pay only option and a seemingly elusive form pack for dispute. How could I comply with taxing a car I don’t own as I have no insurance nor mot to check , both legal requirements so I couldn’t even tax the car if I wanted. The fine is for late taxing yet I would be unable to do this, the fine does not say it is for not informing them! The national dealer I part exchanged the car with confirmed they posted the V5 to the dvla but even this fact seems ignored at Swansea. How does this dissapear?

  7. Posted by Katrina T September 5, 2014 at 2:50 pm

    I sold my car in April/may last year and sent the log book off to dvla within a week, 6-8 weeks later I didn’t receive acknowledgement of this so I rang and sent a letter with all the details they had asked for. I have sent in total 7 letters that “aren’t reaching” the dvla and have had a letter to say I must pay a fine or be taken to court. I refuse to pay when I have done what is legally asked of me but I don’t want to go to court and have a criminal record as I need a clean DBS for my career. What happens if they take me to court but don’t back down? I’m really frustrated and quite honestly scared. I don’t have any spare money to pay fines as I’m a single mum with no family to help me. What do I do?

  8. Posted by Cameron Harper September 6, 2014 at 12:09 am

    Ha, Gary I am in the same situation right now, they haven’t received any evidence of me sending the log book off and have tried to give me a £100 fine, so I ignored them thinking oh they will realise that they have made a mistake. Then bang 5 months later, a court summons and a threat of a £1000 fine, safe to say they are not getting a penny, the current owner who I have contact with does not have the logbook, but still holds their green slip and has been insured on the vehicle since they purchased it, they make me laugh, I said that I was going to say the same thing because plain and simple, it is their fault, so they can suck a fart out of my arse as they are not getting a penny from me lol

  9. Posted by Sheena Vaughan September 11, 2014 at 4:17 pm

    This has been a very insightful page for me.

    I sent off three documents in the ONE envelope to the DVLA by first class post!! Some how only one of the three documents arrived!! I am now required to pay £50 because of the incompetence of their processes. It beggars belief. When I raised my concern I too was asked if I to sent the documents by recorded delivery. As if that mattered given they had received one of the documents BUT not the others? This is a joke. The member of staff also claimed that the DVLA has a zero error rate in their processes!! I think Harvard Business School needs to pay them a visit as this is a miracle and thousands of businesses throughout the world can benefit from this truly outstanding error free Centre.

  10. Posted by Gavhar Khodjaeva October 2, 2014 at 8:43 am

    i sent my biometric residence permit yesterday with the form DVLA sent me. i sent it via express secure delivery and wrote them a cover letter confirming that I sent my document and asking them to send it back with the enclosed envelope! but I completely forgot to pay for that envelope!! I checked the delivery and It’d been delivered! now I’m really worried if I never get my documents back!! what chances that i won’t get my documents back?

  11. Posted by Jessica Mwanzia October 12, 2014 at 2:15 pm

    DVLA have lost identity documents of both my kids!! Earlier this year I applied for a Driving licence for one of my kids, sent birth cert and NINo letter. They arrived, licence arrived to us but documents never came back. Emailing them has resulted in no reply other than acknowledgements of receipt of email. I then applied for DL for other child and sent birth cert and NINO docs recorded delivery and have received an email saying they have not received them, though I have proof of them having been delivered.
    Very disconcerting loss of identity documents and if they don’t find them soon I think the police need to be notified as there is a distinct possibility of identity theft.

  12. Posted by barry best October 18, 2014 at 2:45 pm

    hello we are getting the same they internatation credit ltd say £80 fine for late tax in 2012 ,,as we had moved house they have just found us ,, not that we were hiding ,,, we had scrapped the car before the tax ran out and informed them ,, by sending the logbook in to the dvla ,,, thanks for your letter on here the dvla has never informed us or if they did it went to the house we moved from .. see how we go BARRY BEST

  13. ere try this…..bought a car , sent off the docs immediately. next day car is stolen, police notified next day. 4 working days later log book turns up. 4 days later, police call me, they have found the car but its not registered to me. despite dvla knowing the car was stolen. theif sold car to a guy who then applied for a log book and got it 2 days after mine was issued! took six months to get car back from the police as they couldnt decide who owned the car and whilst in the storage pound, over £1000 of damage was done to it. poor car still sitting outside, lost £1000′s. now in court monday as dvla towed another of my vehicles because it was not sorn and they clocked it (on a private peice of land!) if dvla hadnt cocked up in first place i wouldnt have a battered bmw on my property thus having space for non sorned car where they wouldnt have been able to touch the bloody thing. that car was clamped then towed and i couldnt afford to get it out so thats another £800 outta pocket. should have been a florist!! good day x

  14. Posted by Colin Pattison November 13, 2014 at 1:23 pm

    Hi, I sold my scooter Sept 19, the new owner completed and signed the relevant section of the V5 and I gave him the correct green section for tax/insurance purposes, as required by law. I kept a photocopy of the V5 and posted (ordinary post, not recorded) it to the DVLA to the address on the V5. The DVLA claim they didn’t receive the V5 and are asking me to pay a fine (£35 or more if I don’t pay up quickly) then will take me to court. I sent them a photocopy of the V5, which shows it has been completed by the new owner, making it useless to anyone else and advised them that I did post it to them on Sept 21st. They have ignored this ‘evidence’ and state that’s it’s my responsibility to contact them, if my confirmation notification of new ownership doesn’t arrive within four weeks. I’m tempted to pay the £35, just to get them off my back and not lose any more sleep over it, but I’m also tempted to go to court. Anyone have any advice?

  15. Posted by Abe December 3, 2014 at 9:41 am

    DVLA did the same to me and just got a letter saying me to pay them £35 and £50 if that’s not paid on time, then the court!!, They want money from me over V5 hasn’t been sent! But I did almost 5 months ago and another issue that When I was at Holiday, they clamped my car because road tax was ended and it past few days after of it so I was back home, they said I have to pay fine otherwise they would take the car, it was 10 year old Renault and it wort around £ 600 by that time it was at least 3 times covers the fine I had so they got my car in 2010 I thought everything was fine until 2 months ago in 2014!! someone knocks my door and wait in the White van outside of my house for hours, I didn’t answer the door and I saw he left letter with lots of threatings and huge mount of money like over £2000 something with those all interests!! Then My wife wrote a letter saying we haven’t heared anything from you since then and we thought everything was fine then so on.. Then never heared from them again until last Friday early in the morning at the dark it was like 5 or 6 am they knocked my door like I’m a criminal and they are the police!! My 5 year old little girl was shaking behind of me and my wife and I couldn’t understand what was going on I asked them who they were and They said they are coming from the court and they told me to opend the door and pay the money! I was so angry Shouted at them but my wife paid them like something like £230 then they gone. I feel so unsafe since then we all wake up so early every morning after this happend last week. This DVLA have communication problems with people, they think they can do everything to people and I’m so stress as I have an heart issue myself!!

  16. Posted by David birch December 8, 2014 at 11:53 am

    I bought car 12/09/2014 had car delivered to my home address and put in parking bay following morning I taxed the car online backed dated to oct 1st 2014 in my local library,6wks later I receive letter from DVLA saying had commited an offense of unlawfully keeping motor vrhicle on the road with no roadfund license,and if I don,t pay fine by 18/12/2014 I will be taken to court for the offence! I have written to them pleading my case ; I backed dated to start of the month as this was only thing could do, but they are saying I commited an offence and that’s all that matters.

  17. Posted by Alan Stewart January 18, 2015 at 5:18 pm

    I have had untaxed uninsured car , outside my door for 6 months . Told Police 4 weeks ago , they say DVLA problem . I have e-mailed DVLA 12 times , no response . Local council says it is nothing to do with them ! It all sounds very familiar , in my opinion DVLA and Police are not fit for purpose , like the story of , Somebody , Nobody and Anybody , in other words they could not care less !!

  18. Posted by rob murphy January 22, 2015 at 11:47 pm

    On reading your web thought you might like to hear of another DVLA fiasco.
    My son is diabetic and as such must renew his licence every three years.
    In October 2014 he received a letter to say he had to go for a field vision test at spec savers which he did. The results failed him and as such the DVLA cancelled his licence.
    As my son receives regular eye tests at the Liverpool Royal St Pauls eye Hospital, he found it strange that he as not aware of any changes to his eye sight he made an appointment with the specialists at St Pauls and they carried out full eye tests and field test .
    The results here showed that my son passed the necessary tests as required by the DVLA.

    He sent an appeal to the DVLA with a copy of the new results and highlighted that the eye specialists doctors were satisfied with his eyesight. The DVLA after weeks of waiting sent a reply that my son would have to go back to spec savers to repeat the eye test.

    We are now in the catch 22 situation and going around in circles, we will be informing the DVLA that we will seek to take this case to court as I believe their actions constitute discrimination on the disabled with no regard to the professional evidence submitted in this case.

    If anyone has any experience on this type of issue Please contact me as we will not accept the DVlA decision without fighting the decision that affects my sons future and livellyhood.

    Regards Rob

  19. Posted by Darren January 26, 2015 at 1:38 pm

    Same story here i sold a car back in October received a notice saying it’s due for taxing.. This was a good 10 weeks later so I rang them they told me to write a letter in and put the new owner details on the letter so I did… Got another letter saying I have not taxed the vehicle… Wrote yet another letter then this morning.. I have a fine for not taxing the vehicle Tried ringing them up its impossible to actually speak to someone… F#@k you DVLA

  20. Posted by Rob January 29, 2015 at 2:16 am

    I just had a debtor collector at the door and paid them £560

    My partner got a DVLA fine for £60 for non notification of sale of a vehicle 5 years ago. We argued it and have a copy of the notification we sent. Over 2 years ago Marston Group sent a letter to my parents house saying they were going to cease property for £560 (even though she’s never lived there). We went to Basildon magistrates court and they reversed a magistrates court decision prior which we had no knowledge of and told DVLA they had to reissue the fine for £60 for us to then contest it in court or pay it. At the time and after all the trouble i decided we’d pay it as the trouble that it had caused and lost time was worth more than the £60….. but we never got a bill or demand from the DVLA and today i ended up paying bailiffs £560 as DVLA went to court in Manchester again and court ruled again against us in our absence.

    Question is now ive paid the fine how do i go about getting it back.

    On a separate matter we bought a car last year and paid 12 months road tax only to find the car was a non runner when we collected it. DVLA have the request for refund £225 and have the tax disc when they requested it but havent had any money back from them.

    To be honest i feel DVLA are thieves

  21. Welcome to a dictaroship, we used be just have a simple common law system… A makes a claim in court against B, they both put forward their case, a jury of 12 then decides the outcome.

    This age old law has been around longer than the psychopaths in parliament, who technically only have the force of law by consent of the goverened, and their subsequent psychopathic laws that are for big business and against the people.
    Another 1 is the postal act, it’s not “legal” since around 2011 for parcel companies to hold parcels to ransom until you pay them money to release the parcel, which before 2011 they were still trying just not “legally” people were getting tired of this and looking if the “law” (legal) was being followed, noticed it wasn’t so would fight for their parcel without paying a ransom. The higher ups in the parcel companies realised this was effecting their already massive profits, so they got hold of some bill pusher in parliament, waxed their pockets, and wallah! a new “act” on the books saying it’s perfectly legal to hold peoples parcels to ransom…

    Dave travels to the bank 1 saturday after working long hours all week just to keep his head above water, on the way to the bank pc dogsboddy pulls him over, resulting in his car being impounded with a heavfty fine or worse, the threat of being crushed. After he finally walks the rest of the distance to the bank in the freezing cold in only his t-shirt he realizes that due to a bank charge fee it has left his account a few quid shy of being able to cover the numerous ammounts of direct debits, 1 of them happens to be his insurance. 3 days after his car has been taken he receives a letter from the insurance company stating that his insurance has been canceled.

    Mr potter at number 36 thinks the police do an Outstanding Job!

    This country if full of clowns….

    Keep watching the x-factor though folks, everything is fine….

  22. Posted by Jacqui February 11, 2015 at 2:46 pm

    Heres my problem (really hope to get some feedback!)

    End of Feb 2014 my car was written off and SORN to DVLA. In March 2014 I moved house bought a new car and changed my address with DVLA

    In January 2015 I received a letter from magistrates court telling me i was charged with ‘failure to give information regarding the driver of a vehicle’. First Id heard of offense that apparently occurred in Feb 2014 but they wrote to me at old address in June 2014. As they hadn’t heard back they took me to court for the offense in July 2014 and then were taking me to court again in January 2015 for not getting in touch.

    need to know best plan of action. Ive been given 6 points and £600 fine :0

  23. Posted by Tink February 17, 2015 at 2:45 pm

    I sent off the logbook for a van my brother gave my partner.
    I told my brother I would sort out the log book for him as he was off on holiday in a few hours and had loads still to do.
    I forgot to remove the new keepers slip off the log book when I sent it off.
    This was back in the late summer of 2012. Having still not received the log book despite several calls to the DVLA we had to go through to my brother to see if he had a tax renewal reminded so we could tax the van over the phone. The DVLA sent back the new keepers slip in my partners name but to a wrong address. The person at that address kindly returned it to him after hunting down the possible address it could have been with similar post codes.
    Well that proves they got the log book as it was still attached to the log book that was in my brothers name. this was about a year or so after sending it off.
    Now we have been unable to use the van as we can not get an mot, tax, ect without paying out for a new logbook. which is not down to us losing.
    The situation is now that the van has to be scraped as it would cost more to get back on the road than its worth.
    So we have no option but to payout for a new logbook so we can scrape the van!!!
    We are still no where near sorted out having sent all the supporting documents off repeatedly via recorded delivery. Which have been signed for. My brother and I are still trying to get some kind of response out of the DVLA as to why we never got the log book and as to why my brother is still listed as the owner, but as yet has only had 1 sorn document and several threating letters for £1000 ?

  24. Posted by bigdrive February 22, 2015 at 9:41 am

    SORN reminder letters not sent by DVLA – we have 3 cars on our drive that ive been meaning to fix or get a scrappy to pick up since3 2007, when i get a V11 from DVLA we declare SORN on line.

    But today I thought “i havnt declared SORN in a while on those cars”, when I checked my email, we haven’t declared SORN since Feb 2013 on 2 of them and August 2013 on the other.

    Now there is no way the postman has lost 3 V11′s so does this mean

    1) After a few years of declaring SORN the DVLA the DVLA stops fretting about them ?
    2)They have stopped sending V11s, in the hope i dont notice and can send me big fines ?
    3) something else ?

    what should i do now ?

  25. Posted by trevor bristow March 3, 2015 at 4:47 pm

    i sold a bike 3 years ago 2012 sent off the slip 1st class 3 years later a dept collection agency letter came saying £80 fine for late licencing fee i phoned dvla they said it was lost, not taxing a vechile is a summery offence it should not go straight to a dept collection agency but to court 1st which they have not done i explained this to the agency who ssssaid i could get a 1000 pound fine we argued then they said did you inform dvla that i had not recieved comformation i said no i do not need to imform them so i looked it upthere is no statuary power requiring anyone to ring them and no legal obligation to contact dvla they are bullies who will not listen and are just after the motorist i am waiting to go to court people have to stand up for there rites its easy just to pay the fine but why should they get away with it all the time .

  26. Posted by Eddie McKinley March 21, 2015 at 11:31 am


    I am having the same issue with DVLA claiming no notification and send out the LLP. I have challenged them as highlighted in numerouse posts here regarding notifiaton process, phoning them and Interpretation Act.

    The reply I have received quotes the following for your information in terms of the Interpretation Act not applying to them

    “It was stated in the case of Petit v Mitchell 1842 that ‘as soon as an article is put into the hands of a party that is a delivery to him. Petit v Mitchell(1842) 4 MAN & G 819 at 814 per Maule J Taken from WORDS & PHRASES legally defined, 3rd edition,Volume 2 D-J published by Butterworths. In other words delivery is not effected until the itme is in the hands of the recipient as opposed to merely sending it to him and replying on normal service of documents.”

    Looks like they are ignoring previous court cases and taking another route. I would imagine that if they want this then they should change the regulations to have you send it recorded delivery

  27. Posted by Simon March 23, 2015 at 4:17 pm

    The DVLA are still at this,i believe the Post Office are in on the scam with the DVLA.
    As well as loosing V890 SORN forms they are now also loosing V5 documents and charging £25 for replacements.
    Bunch of crooks.

  28. Posted by ManixZero March 24, 2015 at 12:09 pm

    Hi Gary,

    Nothing has changed!

    Tomorrow I am in court charged apparently with

    ‘Failing to forthwith deliver notification to the secretary of state, on the registration document or in writing as required by Regulation 22(2)(b) of the Road Vehicles (registration and Licensing) Regulations 2002 and section 59(1) of the Vehicle Excise and Registration Act 1994.’

    First I knew about all of this is when bailiffs turned up wanting my TV! I popped along to my local HMCTS to make a statuary declaration. I was then given a new court date for the original offence.

    That date is tomorrow! I have got my statement for their Worships and some further reading with regards to previous cases and additional information showing that the DVLA regularly lose incoming mail. So I now look forward to 150 mile trip and another days holiday down the swanny!

    I will let you know how it goes!

    It does seem though that if you sell a cat the DVLA swindle an £80+ fine out of you and if you buy a car the always charge you an extra £25 as the NEVER send you a V5 and you have to go to the local DVLA to tax your car!



  29. Posted by ManixZero March 26, 2015 at 8:37 am

    Well went to court, having rejected the Prosecutions kind offer to pay up and would drop the charges, I appeared before the magistrates. The DVLA prosecutors (2) stated that I had acted unlawfully by not sending off my V5.

    My Statement:

    I believe myself to be innocent of the charge that I ‘failed to forthwith deliver notification to the secretary of state, on the registration document or in writing as required by Regulation 22(2)(b) of the Road Vehicles (registration and Licensing) Regulations 2002 and section 59(1) of the Vehicle Excise and Registration Act 1994.’

    I sent off the V5c Registration Document for vehicle X123XXX to the DVLA (DVLA, Swansea. SA99 1BA) the day 03/03/2013 I sold the vehicle by, First Class post and in the presence of the new keeper. I thought nothing more of it, having no legal duty to do so. Under Section 7 Interpretations act 1978 t, it is deemed served once sent.

    The Prosecution withdrew their case and I was free to go!

    1 additional point – When I arrived at court there were about 15 people waiting to go in. The DVLA prosecutors spoke to all of them. All but 4 seemed to simply pay up an went home. £80 x 11 people = £880 for the DVLA in one afternoon in one court!

    It is scandalous – Time to complain to my MP I think!


  30. Posted by JoeBoro March 28, 2015 at 8:38 am

    I received a letter from the DVLA asking for £40 for failing to notify them after my lease deal had expired on a car and ownership transferred. I sent them a curt reply telling them that I did SEND the V5 to them by 1st class post immediately after transfer of ownership. I also asked them to state precisely where in English Law I was liable. In a patronising response the DVLA upped the fine to £80, quoted the Petit v Mitchell 1842 case (as above) and said the onus was on me to prove I posted the V5 in good time. In the same letter received they have referred to an incorrect registration number in their explanation. F’kin clowns. I am prepared to take this to court. However, I live 300 miles from Swansea so will they cover my court costs and travel expenses?

  31. Posted by Sam April 3, 2015 at 1:27 pm

    Dear Gary,

    Thank you for sharing your experience with DVLA. We are a small used car centre, stocking 15 – 20 cars. We have had a similar bitter experience with DVLA.

    1) We sold a car to a customer who exported the vehicle to Cyprus in October 2014, we also sent DVLA the export section from the V5 document to inform them of export. We then relieved a letter in January 2015 stating we need to pay £80 for failing to TAX the vehicle. Wrote back to DVLA to inform them the export section was sent in October 2014. DVLA then wrote back to say that we are still liable as they did not receive the export section in October 2014 and provided me with a Late licensing penalty dispute form to fill out and send back.

    I sent back the dispute form with a copy of the export section which we have kept on file, with a shipping certificate from the shipping company with date of export and also a copy of the invoice to whom we sold the vehicle too.

    No surprise DVLA have rejected the dispute and wrote back to say the decision has not changed and we are still liable for the £80 penalty, and any further letter will not be replied to and will only be kept on file.

    Within a week I have had two letters from a Debit collection agency asking us to pay the penalty. The DVLA are been unfair and are using this method to rip people off, Please help as I’m not sure what to do. Don’t really want Bailiffs to turn up to the store.

    Will really appreciate some guidance.

    Kindest Regards


  32. Posted by Reg April 7, 2015 at 2:41 am

    The DVLA in UK is running extremely behind other Western nations, where major changes related to your car registration can be reported easily at any post office through a live online system. The confirmation is immediate and receipts are printed and issued to the clients on the spot. Seller and client can thus complete a sale instantly with confirmation to all sides, including the authorities. The updated registration can be mailed through the post.

  33. Posted by Charlotte April 9, 2015 at 12:15 pm

    I find the automated service for the DVLA one of the most useless systems I have ever come across!! it also takes them far too long to respond to an online query.

    I had a problem with my car tax last year, when I went to renew this I realised I had never received my reminder, I double checked all the details with the car dealership and noticed they had put down the wrong address, so I filled in a V62 form to make sure they had my correct address but it was only when I went to renew my tax this year (how a year flies by) I realised again I never received the Vehicle registration in MY name nor did I get another reminder. I tried to call to no avail as it appears to not give you the right options nor does it allow you to speak to a human even though when filling in the email response it asks you to provide your mobile number! (USE IT) The response also didn’t really answer my question and someone had obviously just copied and pasted information from their website to answer my plea for help. I have subsequently filled in ANOTHER V62 form so I am hoping this does not get lost in the post or the DVLA does not lose it! I am now nervously waiting for some sort of fine so I will be disputing this as I had followed the right course of action and yet somehow my posted documents have been lost.

    How can an organisation operate like this???

  34. Posted by Majid April 14, 2015 at 1:21 pm

    Hi all,

    I am in the same situation, sold the car 8 months ago, moved abroad, and now they have sent me a court letter. Seems like DVLA will do anything apart from be sympathetic and help.

    Apart from pleading not guilty, is there anything else we can do Gary?

  35. Posted by Katie baker April 22, 2015 at 3:33 pm

    Hi I really need help my vehicle has just been clamped for no road tax I have being fighting with dvla for my logbook of the former keeper and they just keep saying they lost the paper work and will send me my new logbook but still not come so I can’t tax it hence now it has been clamped please help as I can’t afford to pay £100 to get the clamp off plus £25 for new logbook and the £250 for the tax. It is the dvla fault for not sending it me isn’t it I have called them every day for the last 6 months please help

  36. Posted by Daniel D April 28, 2015 at 1:21 pm

    Hi, just wanted to add to the wise words on here and what Robert Garrish posted.

    What people have to do is to deprogram their heads and understand that every aspect of your existence is being controlled and your lied to from Birth to Grave. DVLA and every other Gov (Including the Gov UK PLC) are LTD companies that must under legal law make a profit off YOU!. Police are all LTD companies, the Administrative Courts LTD companies, Merton Council LTD company, HMRC LTD.

    Do you get it? You own NOTHING your car was given to the DVLA when you or the Car dealer ‘Registered’ it with them on your behalf, now you are just the Registered KEEPER and you must adhere to their rules and statutes. How do you think they can just take your property? Because its not your property. Why do you think they can tax your car or indeed HOUSE its not your property, you and no one has Allodial Title i.e. the original Deeds to your house the original Deed to your car. You get the benefits of DVLA administrating your documents (Very Badly it seems but Thanks) but then you’ve agreed to be Fined. If you can win in their courts as suggested Great go-for-it, I know its very upsetting, even when you know this stuff. They work off our fear and use their threats.

    Also, to see how corrupt your councils/Gov are and how much of our money they actually have look at Clint Richardson and the CAFR in the USA then understand that we have exactly the same system that hides the fact that far from being in debt and no money for your services, every Gov/Council has hundreds of millions in the Black but using ‘Legal’ practices they hide every years income from you me their investments by putting everything as a FUTURE LIABILITY to be paid in the future and in the mean time the money is diverted into shares of every major corporation that government/agencies own the bulk of its shares! Here is the link


    But nothing to see here …….

  37. Posted by Stephen Johnson May 3, 2015 at 6:23 pm

    I am writing about a different subject, I hope someone can answer my question. My son recently moved house, when he came in from work last week there was a bailiff letter waiting for him threatening to remove items from his house because of a unpaid parking fine. The fine was for the previous owner of the property, when the DVLA were contacted they said the fine was for the address not the person and car, because the person who owned the car did not change his address they said my son was responsible for the fine. Is this right. If it is he could have a parking fine every week and my son is responsible. He has contacted them and sent evidence that he has just brought the house, but I would like to find out if this is true, in case it happens again.

  38. Posted by Michael Smith May 19, 2015 at 5:17 pm

    Hi, I was wondering if you guys can give me advise. I am so much stress. I bought motorcycle around spring time 2014, and sent my logbook to DVLA, who took about 3 months to sent it back with new SORN and new number plate as they stated that some one else has same number plate as mine, so they changed it. I had my motorcycle insured at the time I bought it. I only drove the motorcycle for first 2months afterwards I didnt drive the motorcycle any more. In November 2014, I received a fine from DVLA why I didn’t insure my motorcycle with the number plate the sent to me. I wrote a letter back to them that I didnt use my motorcycle on the road, so if you dont use it then you dont need to insure it. But they still didnt accept my explanation. Instead they sent me a court letter. Shall I plea guilty or not guilty?
    I would really appreciate your help.

  39. Posted by Davey May 23, 2015 at 2:25 am

    I bought a Peugeot 406 on eBay. The seller was a PITA and started an Unpaid Item Dispute but I was not going to travel until I had the insurance documents in my hand. The auction ended on Saturday afternoon when my insurers are closed so the soonest I could phone was 9 am on Monday. The document arrived around mid-day on Tuesday and I travelled on Wednesday. By then they had already re-listed the car! When I reached the seller’s father’s house I was told that they wanted an extra £10 to cover the re-listing fee! The tyres on the car were borderline illegal and the brakes weren’t Rolls-Royce either so I was going to walk away. In the end I got it for the auction price. I filled-in the front half of the V5 but allegedly the back half was lost so they were going to post it to me. I parked the car overnight at the marina and first thing next morning I bought the car two new front tyres. The car had almost three months of tax left so for the time being all was well. Unfortunately I was NEVER SENT a new V5. As I didn’t even have the green slip from the back half of the V5 I was going to be unable to re-tax the car. Even worse I was also unable to SORN it! On the last day of the 406′s tax I drove it to the marina’s secure car park and parked it. I then reverted to my old Peugeot 405. I tried to SORN the car at Post Offices but was fobbed-off as “We don’t keep the forms anymore” (I tried several POs hoping that one might still have the forms) I was told that I had to SORN the car online but when this was tried the question “Enter your Document Number” was the problem. I then wrote out a SORN letter by hand and posted it but of course only the Registered Keeper can tax or SORN a car.

    About a month after the tax had expired I received a new V5 (log book) and with the benefit of 20-20 hindsight I should really have SORNed it again even though my handwritten SORN should have lasted twelve months. I would surmise that when the DVLA computers printed the new V5 this AUTOMATICALLY cancelled my handwritten SORN but how was I to know this?

    They really did try it on in attempting to get an £80 SORN fine from me but I would not back down. I told the debt collection companies to go and chase the seller who never sent me the log book as it was his fault. With the car being in a secure compound over a hundred miles from my address and with them not knowing where it was, their chances of clamping it or towing it were slim to none!

    I told them repeatedly that it was a clerical error and I said that they should be chasing the bloke who never sent me the log book. They retorted that I should have gone to a local vehicle licencing office and paid for a new log book but why? My “local” VLO is about sixty miles away and the parking is diabolical and expensive and realistically it would have taken all day. Eventually the debt collection agencies gave up as I suspect that they knew full well that if it went to Court they would have been on a hiding to nothing. Take care!

  40. Posted by Davey May 23, 2015 at 3:17 am

    Re Michael Smith and the motorbike. DVLA keep changing the rules as they go along.

    Towards the end of the paper tax disc era DVLA made it illegal to have a valid tax disc unless there was insurance to go with it. I got caught out with this disgusting law when I bought a Ford Scorpio diesel estate in London. The car was bought as a project as it will hardly run probably because the exhaust is choked solid with soot. The car which is basically a non-runner was recovered with a 4×4 and trailer and stored on a farm but to save any snide remarks and cat-calls about “Untaxed Vehicles” I did buy the remaining tax from the seller. It was winter and the weather was awful so tinkering with the new toy was not really an option. If I had known how bad the weather was going to be I would have cashed-in the remaining tax but I had hoped to repair the car and use it but it was not to be. When there was just two weeks of tax remaining those Shylocks at DVLA sent me an £80 fine for no insurance! BUT YOU DON’T NEED INSURANCE FOR A BROKEN DOWN CAR THAT IS PARKED ON A FARM! The “crime” was having an in-date tax disc with no insurance to cover it, i.e. Guilty until proven innocent! When I started driving it was a crime to DRIVE without insurance but now the Shylocks have made it an offence to OWN a vehicle (even a broken down one) unless it is SORNed or taxed and insured.

    I actually know a VW Beetle enthusiast who had stripped-down a Beetle so he could restore the body by welding. The chassis which has the VIN number was hanging on the wall of his workshop but in spite of this he got sent a SORN fine. IMHO they are Nazi tyrants.

    Sorry to disappoint but I’d say the crux of the matter is to do with the tax disc and the insurance. The other way that they catch people is with the Tax or SORN trick as vehicles now have to be either Taxed or SORNed. My Scorpio was taxed but nowadays they want to have their cake and eat it (being fined for HAVING tax beggars belief but they probably need the money to send to Bongo-Bongo Land) Good luck!

  41. Posted by Debbie May 28, 2015 at 3:39 pm

    hiya I’m in a dillema I just had a court summons for no car insurance my car was written off in oct I sorned it but by the court summons coming I don’t think they have recieved it I don’t know wot to do I have emailed the dvla stating all this but no reply as off yet

  42. Posted by Masya May 30, 2015 at 7:05 pm

    Can anyone please help me?! I received today a fine of £400 from DVLA. They said it was first much less( in Oct) and that they had sent me several letters before to make me aware of the penalty but since I have moved to this new property, this was the first time I had received a letter form them. When moving I went to the post office and I told them to change my new address but I had nothing received from them at this new address. They assume I ignored the letter and that I didn’t want to pay the bill, the truth is I didn’t receive any previous acknowledge! £400 Is a lot money and I don’t want to pay it when I know i’m not guilty. Does anyone know how to make them aware of this misunderstanding?

  43. The DVLA took me to court in April over not taxing a car which had been scrapped a year ago. To cut a long story short, they lost every piece of paper I sent them. Its not the first time either. This time I got a solicitor and pleaded not guilty all the way. The hearing went ahead, before which my solicitor sent the court and the DVLA a letter, which read like a Carry On comedy. If it had gone to trial a witness from the DVLA would have had to attend court and travel a distance of 300 miles. On the day, they withdrew the case. The court have awarded costs in my favour. Plead not guilty and get a solicitor is my advice. They are a shambling mess.

  44. Posted by jan June 29, 2015 at 12:43 am

    I need some help/advice please urgent!!!!!,

    my brothers van has been lifted for no tax(a neighbour told me no paperwork put through the letterbox), however he sorned this but dvla says they never recived, the problem I have is I dont drive and there is no insurance on this. When I called police Scotland told cant help me as not the owner, unfortunately my brother suffers with depression hence why he put his van of the road and let insurance expire and wont deal with it in his state and doesn’t deal woth mail etc.
    Does anyone have any advise for me thank you really stressed as van worth around 3k and full of tools.

  45. Posted by diana bryant July 3, 2015 at 12:08 pm

    I’ve just found this site and am so glad i did, felt as if i was on my own with the dvla problem.
    I part exchanged my old peugeot for a volvo. The seller said he was going to scrap it. Pretty sure he did as the car was on it’s last legs. Sent my paperwork off
    but I had a letter from the dvla shortly after saying I had a fine as I was still the owner. They have written to me recently and said the same thing. I wrote back and repeated that i no longer owned and gave the address of the person they should chase up. This what they said in an email to me.

    You state that you no longer have the vehicle; however, you remain liable for the penalty unless you have received a disposal confirmation letter dated before the date of the offence.
    For our records to be amended you must write to the address below so that our records can be updated.
    You will need to provide;
    • Date of disposal
    • New keeper’s name and address
    • Your signature
    • Registration number, make and model of the vehicle
    They tell me that I have to give them the date of disposal. How should I know?
    Really worried about this, they’ve passed my fine on to a debt collection agency.

  46. Posted by Paul Weston July 9, 2015 at 11:53 am

    Curently just received one of the DVLA pay up or else letters. But for slighlty different reasons:- Car was cat C damaged last year (apparently as I have just found out last week) it seems DVLA put a Vehicle Identy Check (VIC) flag against my car on their database (without informing me) as a result of this they do not to send Tax Reminders to these owners. The damage to my car was so light it never came off the road (just the usual insurance write off due to new part costs). After receiving 2 Tax reminders for my motorcycles (and paying them of course) I was shocked to get a fine for non displaying road tax for my car. If I had been sent the reminder this would not have happened.

    Having explained all this to them they dont care and have given me until Monday 13/07/2015 to pay. What they do state is that it is up to the owner to tax the vehicle thus making the Reminder letter system obsolete. FYI I have been told the VIC check is to be stopped as it did nto have the desired effect and caught less than 0.0 of ‘ringed’ cars. I see some major cost savings for DVLA here by not sending reminders out .. think of the fines they would receive.. I am writing to my MP.. These people are narrow minded crooks who refuse to listen to reasonable people!

  47. Posted by Revolution July 24, 2015 at 9:16 pm

    I had my car clampled one sunday morning at around 8o’clock. I have SORN the car but carleessly parked it on the pavement in front of my house. Around the evening time we have asked a friend who helped us paid 260 pounds and the car had been released. Now i parked the car in the garage. Awaiting to save some money to fix it before taxing it, i just received a letter to go to court in Cambridge which is miles away from where i live. I dont know why things are like this in England where human beings are hidding under laes framed by human beings to oppress other human beings. In France where i grow up things like that do not happen. We stand for our freedom. Why cant we fight this system. Lets stand in fighting this system. Let strike and go an occupy that Dvla building. This is a time of revolution for you Motorists. Arise.

  48. Posted by Revolution July 25, 2015 at 7:05 pm

    Lets not back up. This us a joke. Lets confront them seriously. They created the controversial laws to oppress us in order to maintain their absurd lifestyle. The government cut is hitting them hard; that is why their teeth had been turned on us. We can persue the fight up to the human right tribunal. Lets not sleep. Lets seriously start. Iam doing some serious consultations and will soon give the outcome.

  49. Posted by john ward July 25, 2015 at 7:34 pm

    I am having a nightmare with the DVLA in feb I bought a van and taxed it on line. Sold van 31 march and sent off forms. Now still trying to get refund and whilst talking to the dummies on the phone they are charging me for April,even though the new owner has taxed it from April 1st.
    Have emailed chief exec , and it would appear his staff are as thick as the people answering the phones. Can anyone tell me can I take them to the small claims court ? If I charged my customers for something that they have not had I would soon be in prison for theft.Thanks for any help .

  50. I’ve had the same problem!!! I wrote my car off in January 2015 and didn’t have my papers as all was lost in the car. I was told by dvla to write in to offically inform them!! Which I did!! Got a letter back asking to confirm registration and sign. Months later I receive a final warming letter stating ive been fined £100! What the hell!! So confused! Dvla have said they have no record of my car being written off! Angry doesn’t come close!! I’m currently writting a letter to dispute this fine!!!

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